Where and how did Biotransenergetics (BTE) originate? What is the relationship between Dr. Lattuada and Brazil? How did the collaboration with Jim Garrison, founder of Ubiquity University?
Find out the answers to these questions by reading the interview:
Q: Can you tell us something about yourself? Who are you, where do you come from and what led you to create Biotransenergetics (BTE)?
A: Well, in the meantime I was pushed with tireless moral blackmail to do medicine by my mother; I had already enrolled in political science because there was no psychology faculty, but I vaguely knew that I was going to be a psychoanalyst. After 7 years of medicine, in the meantime I did all the various training in homeopathy, iridology, bioenergetics, etc., after which I did the specialty in psychology, or rather, in psychotherapy and then in the meantime they contacted me from a university, the European campus of Holjen university, which offered me to do a teaching and at the same time obtain a PhD, so I did a PhD in Berastadi in Lugano. This as regards the more bureaucratic part, let's put it this way ... Collaterally to this, immediately after graduating and then in 82, there was the meeting with Brazil which was a turning point, not so much for the contents but how much for this passage from the mind to the heart: this first to perceive what it means to pass from the mind to the heart. And that was a bit of a guide to my life also because I was a young doctor veteran of 68 '; in short, it was a lot of head and little heart. Then above all to create a different methodology - I always say - you have to be very presumptuous: I was not happy with anything that was around, I could not do the surrender to no teacher around, and then I do the teacher myself. So from this act of presumption I think I am very lucky because just as Marlene first and Mela after I was put in my path, in the meantime I had these two teachers angels, teachers, teachers of heart. And this long journey of opening the heart, which is not finished yet, however, is marked by the construction of the BTE, which is as if someone had decided to send me down some teachings for what it took for me to open my heart and, therefore, having to know how to pass it on to others. So I can certainly say that BTE is something that "happened to me", it was built in front of me and it was first of all my guide, therapy, methodology, that works or, I hope, has worked to an extent for me. and then then I have to through others. This is with regard to the BTE training process, which then in fact had all its academic institutional passages because in any case I believe I am a "middle person," both because I was born in Milan, because Mediolanum, in the midst of the lands, is perhaps because Capricorn, ... what do I know, however, balance and being in the middle is one of the ... and therefore this play between the rational academic world and the shamanic spiritual world, without ending up for the tangent is one of the prerogatives and also one of the essential lines of the BTE.
Q: Do you think you have always felt this spiritual and shamanic world inside you or did you discover it in Brazil? At what moment did it reveal itself in your path?
A: I discovered it more in Brazil, but I can say that thanks to Brazil I discovered that I always have been. In the sense that I remember moments of mystical ecstasy as a kid in the oratory, more or less 13-14 years. I remember that there was this educator who had come one summer among us and I remember this summer in a very paradisiacal condition, I remember this sense of connection, in those days it was just a speech of Jesus, of Catholicism and I remember that period of extreme connection with something to which I was not yet able to give the name. Then came the 68 'and it deviated towards historical materialism, even if, I can say it later, this struggle for justice - the revolution - was nevertheless driven by a spiritual dill for the betterment of the world and that, for example, I was in a student moment that was very Stalinist - which is saying a lot - and I was there because of friendships with both my high school, that the group I was in was more student-oriented, and then there were the more freaky groups like Lotta Continua, but my soul was increasingly turned towards a more "freak" aspect, more hippie, so to speak .. this hippie freak dimension was undoubtedly a spiritual dimension: romance, fascination for the beat generation, for flower children and all these dimensions, I think it was already a sign of this spiritual connection, which then opened up during another 18-19 year old experience with LSD, which blew up the universe. Then a few more years of respite, always within politics; then the autogenic training was another incredible opportunity around the age of 23, I met Otto Lams, an 82-year-old doctor with a Chinese goatee who taught this autogenic training and I had ecstatic experiences of opening. So the first inner experiences of connection started there. So in Bioenergetics, psychocorporeal, however, I always felt that something was missing and precisely what was missing I found in Brazil which was the trance and, consequently, the heart. So the awakening and realizing it came from 82 onwards, but somehow it was always there.
Q: In a few words or phrases, what has Brazil taught you, apart from going from mind to heart?
A: Above all, the work with… the trance, and therefore fluidity, working with the field, with the spiritual forces, with the elemental forces, that is with nature, yes ... and I can say now, working with the field, which we could then also call precisely with the spiritual world . Then there was also collaterally and immediately, so in 84, the encounter with ayahuasca and therefore also all that dimension of expanded states of consciousness that was in any case collateral. However, all the traditions that I have encountered, therefore both the Umbanda, which was the place of the openings of the heart, and the shamanic dimensions of ayahuasca, rather than other traditions of the type, and the dimensions of the spiritualists and therefore the whole tradition of working with spirits, they are all things that I went "through", but with which I never identified, which was one of the characteristics of the foundation of the BTE and I believe I have received gifts and I think that how much more than best I could take from the various dimensions that I encountered I did, but I always left them, I never identified with that. As far as I'm concerned, all the gifts that this kind of experience has given me have become part of the BTE and therefore something ordinary, which one should experience in ordinary life. Maybe remember from time to time, through some experience, but don't make it a tool.
Q: How did you find Ubiquity? Where did this collaboration come from and how did you meet Jim Garrison?
A: My life is characterized by synchronicity, I believe in everyone's life the more we are careful to recognize, the more we are in harmony, the more we are in the famous flow - "flowing" - the more we flow and I believe that trust is a gift that was given to me and awakened me. The more we flow in trust, the more synchronic events happen. Many have happened to me in my life, from the meeting with Marlene, to the one with Mela and many others. Always profoundly meaningful encounters, that is, I can say that I have met many people in the world and with always significant encounters, people with whom I then made projects or things. Jim is one of these people; we met in Moldova maybe in 2013 and apart from that I really enjoyed introducing him but then we ended up close on the bus on our way to an event in the evening. We started chatting and after half an hour we had already defined that I would be the country partner of UU. There was this immediate recognition and everything has always gone since ... two Yes Men: Yes, yes yes, easy, easy and let's go. We recognize ourselves and go.
Q: What do you think about the role of education right now?
A: I completely align myself with what Jim says, precisely on this possible new Renaissance that goes through a transformation of education, an education that is precisely in step with hyper-complexity and therefore this discourse of Soft Skills [SS] as a point Crucial of world education, which serves humanity, serves the teachers who teach and do not have, is what is needed by the managers who direct and who do not have, for which there is a huge void to fill and there is a thirst huge to quench your thirst. The fact of calling them "Soft Skills" is very pragmatic, very American and also very useful, because as you know the counseling, or the BTE itself, in the end I am talking about awakening potential, self-realization or working with qualities, but in reality these qualities, potentials, are nothing other than, said in expendable and pragmatic terms, they are Soft Skills. Therefore, this meeting of the vagueness of BTE, in the sense that it does not deal much with results in the world, but with the processes of realization of life, this meeting between this realization, transformative dimension of a life cycle and the applicability of this transformative path through Soft Skills in the world, it seems to me very significant and interesting. I've always used the term learning outcomes, and they always asked me which are the learning outcomes of this course - there is no precise one, in the sense that it is a dialogue. It is impossible to say you will have this, this and that; however it is also possible through a dialogue to direct the processes towards specific achievements. This education aimed on the one hand at the realization of the self and on the other to a specific application in certain fields, with these Soft Skills, seems to me the future and it also seems to me to be useful for example in UU & ITI.
Q: How do you think these courses, especially Integral Transpersonal Psychology, can have an impact in the world of education, especially in Italy?
A: I can tell you that I was, like all Italians a bit provincial and backward, skeptical of online teaching. Then it happened that I taught at Sofia University, at the Global PhD, and then I took some online courses and saw how people transformed through these online courses and I changed my mind. Then I also saw the usefulness: people who could never have taken courses, for example people who live in bush Australian, rather than in Dubai, or who are traveling the world because they take adventure courses or extreme sports, so this possibility also to reach people who never could. Or, to come to Italy, to people who are either for work or for economic or geographical reasons, they would not have the possibility to attend academic courses; this is another aspect. But even more there is the question of quality, this concerns the contents of the courses, they are really special and specific, you can't find them elsewhere and, therefore, this is another of the great uses that can have.
To come to the Italian discourse, certainly there must be a sort of awakening, we need to sensitize the market to this thing - it is so innovative and offers so many possibilities that people may not yet be able to grasp it and therefore we must make them understand how much it has value instead. . This passage right from the search for degree, of the recognition of "mother state" who gives you a diploma that you do not even do anything about, or that you do not need from the point of view of skills, but which tells you and authorizes you to be, for example, a psychologist - pass from this to a training that really gives you the tools to be what you know and can be. Taking this step of course is what these courses can offer, but it is also what the person must recognize that they can have. So if we manage to make the Italian market known, to sensitize effectively, I believe that it could undergo a transformation. Things that in these times, as Garrison also says, are in a hurry, so I believe that there is every margin to make this process go in a hurry.
Q: What would you recommend to a high school dropout, a 25-year-old post-graduate, and the first generation who wants to change their life?
A: In my opinion those 25 years old already know this, so to simply have the courage to follow what they feel like doing, because if they don't let themselves be tempted by the old mentality, maybe by their parents, if they don't get into this parenting perspective, I believe that young people - and for young people I would also say i Millenials, that the former Millenials they are already becoming adults - but I think they know that what matters is skills, rather than someone to tell you ... so dare, be curious and look around and follow what they want to know and be, rather than something to achieve. While for the forties and over it is undoubtedly an opportunity to change their life and probably already has a structured life, so even more so an online training that is designed to give anyone the opportunity to train and truly transform their own. life, it seems to me that is absolutely what was needed. It is true that there are some Italian online universities that are functioning quite well, it is a pity that they form according to a vision, at least in the psychological, very classical or neuro-scientific and cognitive field and therefore these contents cannot be found in another university or online , neither in person.
Q: How can a student benefit from this UU & ITI experience?
A: Find something very different from what he's been looking for in college so far. For example, the last course I held at UU, among the students had a boy who is enrolled in psychology at Bicocca. So he did the Foundation in ITP during his training as a psychologist in Bicocca, precisely because he perceived this lack. So we could simply imagine that we live in a building and at a certain point we realize that we have always lived in some floors of this building and that there is an attic that opens us onto a world that we had never noticed. What training in ITP is not even to say that it is concurrent, it is quite another thing, it is an "after", it is an "after" the cognitive approach, the psychoanalytical and humanistic approach, even if in universities you are practically not taught even that. In fact, it is an after: it transcends and includes, it is something you must (we would say ordinarily) feel. If you don't miss it, if your training, if what you, a student, are looking for is a training in neuroscience, go to San Raffaele or Bicocca or a university. It is absolutely not at odds. If you feel that there is something missing there and if there is a yearning for inner experience, skills regarding the mastery of states of consciousness, a psychology of self that deals not only with the highest qualities but which recognizes that every sign, every ailment is a lack of soul, expression, quality and resources and exploration of areas of our Self, then you find nothing else in the academic world. This is absolutely new in academia. So if your antennas are a little on, you can choose a path like this. It is not that you do it to evaluate whether it suits you or what it will give you; it is simply what needs to be done. If at some point you feel an impulse towards a deep knowledge of yourself and the expansion of consciousness and the "spiritual" dimensions of existence, a formation of this type is simply a door that opens to a new world.
Q: What can a student expect in practical terms from this course?
A: He can expect to become a better person who is able to cope with discomfort with love, compassion and competence. Both your own discomfort and that of others.
Q: Diploma recognition: do you have any comments?
A: In the meantime, this training is aimed primarily at all those who are in the world of helping relationships and are not psychologists or have not wanted to be. So it would provide the whole world of people who deal with the helping relationship, a background not only cognitive but also to know how to be and therefore the tools to do the work they are doing better. On the other hand to give greater value, because if you, for example, are a counselor who has decided to do counseling and not psychology because he does not want to study for 5 years things that do not interest him and that he feels somehow discovered, because in reality towards a psychologist who has been through 5 years of hard work there is a sense of inferiority, etc., get a training of this type that gives you everything you need, but allows you to continue to do the your profession or what you like and therefore you can proudly say that you do not want to be a psychologist, but you are a counselor with a degree in ITP. In my opinion it would be an act of extreme force, because rightly if a counselor or a person who deals with the helping relationship wants to have a diploma to work more calmly, he might as well do the Cusano, or another Italian online university. Here you do it as a choice, you do it as a choice to acquire tools and skills to do well what you are doing. Nothing prevents you from going through those classic paths, because then being a diploma recognized in England, you probably then go knocking or going to a university and there will be the recognition process like anyone does, as I did with my medical degree. coming to Switzerland: you must still ask the State to recognize your title, so at that point it will be a negotiation, an evaluation between your title and the government and the state of the country where you live.
Q: There are several teachers in the ITP course, do you want to say a word or two about them? What kind of academic staff is it?
A: In the meantime, they are the people who in the transpersonal and integral world I know a little bit all of them in the world panorama. Those I invited to participate are those who give me the best reliability, especially from the point of view of being people of heart and competent. They will be people who certainly know how to convey what they are.
Q: Can an ITP graduate become a psychotherapist in Italy?
A: So what many find it hard to understand why Italy has a different situation in many parts of the world, after the master's degree, so after the Master (not even after the BA) to become a psychotherapist you have to do 4 years of specialty school. So I do not think that the BA is sufficient, it will take the Master to be able to then take the state exam. Then we'll have to see. The procedure will be: you must have the Master, then the state exam to be able to access a 4-year training. However, as I say, this course is designed from a very pragmatic point of view. It is contradictory, because on the one hand it gives you the tools that claim to favor your transformation and self-realization; on the other hand, it gives you the pragmatic, practical and easily applicable tools - so it seems a contradiction, but the concept is that it is mainly addressed to those who or, as I said, want to move in an area of helping relationship that is not medicalized , diagnosis, protocols, etc., but that it is of the type "I'm with you and help you travel the world". This can be true for the counselor, for teachers, for artists, managers, Soft Skills, so this training is open, we should open the boxes for a moment: it is ITP but it is dedicated to psychologists but it does not replace psychology, not even you. narrows in the psychotherapeutic realm, but provides Soft Skills to be a better person in whatever realm one is. Whether for a manager, in the world of education, or in the helping relationship, or in sports, for example, or in art and so on. It should be seen just like returning to the beginning of our discussion, therefore Soft Skills that are applicable in any area, even in that of the helping relationship and nothing prevents you from becoming a psychotherapist, but it is somehow redundant, or vice versa: to psychotherapists with a classical background this course could be very useful.
Q: How can the ITP program be used concretely in the business world?
A: In any area. As the researches of the multinationals say that what is needed are the Soft Skills; so if you are a manager who knows how to master his emotions, knows how to tolerate uncertainty, knows how to be in trust, knows how to be empathetic with others, who knows how to collaborate rather than not compete, knows how to recognize the energies and messages that are beyond the mind and who knows how to work with the archetypal dimension, if you want to sell more machines you will sell more machines, rather than establishing yourself in any other area. In the world of education, if you are a teacher and have the ability to be in this kind of way in the classroom, you create a resonant and harmonious field so that the students absorb what you want to convey to them better. Same for art and sport. The great thing is that it is absolutely transversal. It teaches you to be better yourself, and therefore you have to ask yourself "How do I best apply myself?"
Think of the whole dimension of eco-solidarity, of social commitment and still very often there is this gap: those who are socially committed usually want to change the world and consider those who are perhaps more in a spiritual dimension as one who runs away from responsibility of wanting to change the world. But as the Further Way teaches us, by changing yourself you change the world, or as Gandhi put it simply. Therefore, this ability to have the tools that teach you to learn from the world, this ability to accept by transforming, because in reality you transform the world when you know how to accept it, because otherwise it is only a struggle and therefore understand that the transformation is an effect. collateral, who teaches you? The whole world of politics ... [joking] should be mandatory for any politician, before you have a politician's license you take an ITP course. Through this approach, the person is taught to become what they are, not what you want or what you believe would be good for them ... Precisely because it passes through the mastery of inner experience and therefore also the training title tries to create the conditions for L'insight which is true knowledge and it comes from within, so if you give knowledge that fills the contents they fill from within, you can only indoctrinate, but if you give knowledge that fostersinsight in the true sense of education, understood as bringing out, then the insight that the person has concern himself and are unique and unrepeatable, they cannot be standardized according to a dogma.
Be total, integral, which, I remember, everyone forgets about it and I also remembered it in Vienna at this integral meeting and no one knew that integral means "not touched": the etymology of integral is "not touched", therefore integral ... many of these holists put things together and say they do something holistic and integral. If you put things together, you do nothing integral, because it is integral already together. Integral means leaving things as they are, dealing with things, interacting and transforming them, but accepting them as they are, recognizing their wholeness, therefore not putting them together. Those who bring body and mind together, how do you put them together? They are already together. You must realize that it is together, for example matter and spirit, or the masculine and the feminine: they are already together. You must be aware of the events and above all that when one is on stage, the other is behind the scenes. But to be aware of this wholeness, you must have a unitary state of consciousness that grasps the process. This seeks to teach training in ITP and not just to read the texts on integral theories, but how to get to your integral theory, which theory, as I always remember, means contemplation. So, how to contemplate unity? This would help us achieve our training.